Marina Blue Penthouse
June 6, 2009 by Lucas Lechuga
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Looks very walkable
Lucas, can you also post the floorplan? Not sure what line it is.
I bet you can get it anywhere and it probably helps to understand the layout better.
Thanks
Thanks Hugo! Just added it at the end.
Is the master shower/bath in the middle of the bedroom? No door? How is a man supposed to masturbate without his wife knowing?
Is this a joke? The views are great but those finishes are ridiculously cheap. Only in miami…
Yes, the shower/bath in the master bedroom is in the bedroom but there isn’t a glass wall to view into the bedroom from the shower or vice-versa. However, I have seen owners replace the wall with glass in order to have a view of Biscayne Bay while you’re showering.
The stairs look terrible
I like that unit…..don’t know about living in that location, but like the layout and love the views…. How much?
Also, any word on Jade Ocean????
Renter Tom,
What do you think it’s worth in this market? Keep in mind that it’s a penthouse on the 57th floor with 2,703 square feet. I’ll then tell you the price at which it’s being offered.
I haven’t heard anything new lately regarding Jade Ocean.
What is the asking price?
reminds me a lot of the units in 900 Biscayne. We looked at units there and found the finishes and overall interior materials to be average run of the mill. These pictures appear to have the same effect…a white wash look, really small kitchen (900 biscayne has a larger kitchen ++).
I do like the loft style. This wouldn’t be desirable for my family, but I can see the layout working for many.
We ended up renting a PH in Met1. Found the highest quality unit (2300 sq/ft+, 3bd/3bath+) out of everything we looked at (<$7500/mo). I was disgusted at the trashy units I saw in Brickell (1 nice one in 1060 Brickell, but redone by owner). I am always amazed at these $1M+ units with hollow core doors, small kitchens, and horrible closets (both space and organizer systems).
I would bet they are asking about $1.4M. Without walking through it or knowing much about Marina Blue and also taking into account that you need to finish it (put hardwoods or tile, real paint) I would say it should be worth about $900K. The views are great, but there are better balcony choices out there. Being a PH doesn’t really mean much of anything other than you have less people on your floor and people give you the dirty/jealous eye in the elevator.
$200/s.f. so $540,600. That’s given that it is “decorator ready”…..if $300/s.f. or above, I’d say pass….. $300/s.f. for direct ocean front, $200/s.f. for downtown, so maybe this is in between…. haven’t explored the area so that is the best I can do.
Also, I wonder if Jade Ocean is out of $$$$$$$. The Solis has been a zombie for about a year now and is sitting there rusting on floor 11. Trump Towers look nice, but usually maybe 12 lights on in two towers (out of about 540+ units). Seriously, there is probably over $1B in units for sale here…..and they aren’t selling.
Should clarify…..Trump Towers 540+ units is just out of towers 1 and 2, wasn’t counting tower 3 since it is finished but 100% empty….. Total of around 810+ units in all three towers.
Not a corner unit and the view is more a south view than the preferable direct east view. Im guessing asking price $1.2 million. Yet probably worth more like $795,000.
Because there is a chance you might lose your view when the lot one block south gets built out. I think the proposed building next door Paramount was it?- was proposed at 60 stories.
Man, I hate to be a negative jerk, and there’s a big difference between “designer-ready” and “done,” but the interior of that unit looks like just about any unit in a decent apartment building these days. I can’t believe those are penthouse finishes for a bathroom and kitchen.
I would prefer a lower floor. I could stare at the 3400 square foot electronic billboard from the American Airlines Arena. Mesmerizing.
http://digitalsignagetoday.com/slideshow.php?p=3&slideshow_id=185#imgtop
I just don’t get it…..if you’re not working downtown, why live there? It has a great view (assuming not blocked later), but the whole urban thing isn’t appealing if you don’t work there….. By the way, watching the storms over the ocean these last few days has been cool. Seriously, the changes in weather, clouds, sky colors, lightening, has been some of the coolest in the last year….. Feek bad about the flooding in SoBe but hey why haven’t they fixed the drainage when there is the ocean on one side and the bay on the other….not like they have to build a bunch of retention ponds, just make sure the pipes go to the ocean or bay, duh.
No publix, no park. I wouldn’t pay a dime without a beautiful park with basketball hoops. I love hoopin’ it up!
Are asking prices of “decorator-ready” units substantially less than similar units that are actually “done”? They should be. “Decorator-ready” is a bunch of marketing crap. In other words, the developer is squeezing more money out of the project but telling the buyer that they’re so goddamn special and privileged to be buying a unit and that PERSONALLY CUSTOMIZING their unit is the ONLY way to go. Go ahead, lay the Brazilian hardwoods instead of the wall-to-wall berber carpet. You deserve it. Why be like everyone else?
Kramer,
It is Paramount Park. It should obstruct the views of PH 1 and Line 1 but not this. But as you said, it is not a corner unit. The best PH in MB is the one directly above line 8 which is PH5.
Yeah, not crazy bout the kitchen finishes, railings etc as others said. Looks like any other cheap building in Brickell or buildings such as Latidude on the River.
For the price range , I am still waiting to see any other building outdoing the 900. Sure enough, Marquis, Paramount, Asia, Apogee etc have nice kitchen finishes, but they cost much more than 900.
I love the location of MB, but more and more, I am convinced that MB is not a first class building, notwithstanding the nice industrial lobby, the sky deck and the location. After all, it all comes down to the units themselves and they are not up to par except line 8 and they are asking stupid shit amount of money for line 8 and it is not worth it.
…and line 8’s are asking between $480 (lowest) to $600(highest)/sf. That is crazy bull shit. In this market, even for a housing bull like me, that looks obscene and ridiculous.
MB prices should not be more than $300/sf for all lines and maybe $350/sf for line 8 ($50 premium for being a corner with 270 degree views).
I do not support the crazy asking prices of the units right now. They need to get corrected either by design or engineered.
When a while ago , I predicted that the bulk sale will actually firm up the prices as the last remaining developer units are being taken off the market, people ridiculed me and they said that the bulk sale set the new price floor of $200. Now that MB is considered 94% sold, my prediction about price hardening is coming true and I am not happy about it at all. I wish the asking prices fall to reflect the reality. But looks like a lot of owners in MB have the holding capacity to create an artificial price hardening.
I took a long look at MB before deciding on 900 Biscayne. The only thing MB has going for it is a nice lobby and location as AJ mentioned above. I was impressed until I got to the units. Floor plans are horrible with some of the units i saw having huge hallways and tiny bedrooms, quality was severely lacking and the overall feel of MB was not that of a class A building. I then walked over to 900 and that sealed the deal for me. In my opinion there is no other building in downtown Miami or Brickell that can even be compared to 900.
Angel, I think Epic is a runner up for 900 Biscayne. It really depends on what you are looking for. There are a lot of 2 story PH units that are decent, but not what you would expect in a PH. And who wants to climb up and down stairs!
We were a little disappointed in the location of 900. Bad neighborhood just 1 block to the west, not really any stores/restaurants in walking distance. I did like the fact there is a people mover stop right next door.
Asking $1.1M
Angel,
I agree with your assessment of 900 Biscayne Bay. It’s on such another level when compared to any other new condo building in Miami. Everything else looks second rate after viewing it. Later today, I’ll try to upload pictures of a gorgeous unit I viewed yesterday at 900 Biscayne Bay.
Does anyone rent out their designer ready, unfurnished condos on a short term basis?
As long as they have appliances, water and electricity, they would be an interesting alternative to hotels.
Elvis,
I have yet to get inside Epic but have heard only good things about it. The neighborhood where 900 is located is a bit sketchy but as long as you don’t venture too far off in the wrong direction you should be fine.
Lucas,
Looking forward to see the pics of the 900 unit. Thanks in advance!
AJ said: “But looks like a lot of owners in MB have the holding capacity to create an artificial price hardening.”
– The real estate fantasy game is up….there aren’t people lined up to get one of those precious units that in in short supply, the velvet rope show is over. Long gone are the days when people were desperate to buy a unit so no matter the owners “holding capacity” it is a shitty investment, let them bleed.
Re: Lucas #27.
Lucas,
It’s funny how every realtor i spoke to when inquiring about 900 all said the same thing you mention in post #27 almost verbatim “900 is quite simply on a whole different level”. At first I thought they were all feeding me a line especially after seeing units at Axis, MB, TMP, 1800, One Miami, 50 Biscayne.., then i saw it for myself. They (including Lucas) were right. It is on a whole different level.
900 and Epic there very nice.
Have you any of you guys seen the inside of Marquis? The PH in this building really defines what a PH is other than just calling it a PH because its on the top floor. Also the four lines on floors 63-65 which are double volume also have a private spa for each and roof top terrace. Then the single PH at Marquis is on floors 65-67.
Also the kitchens and baths are very nice in Marquis.
After closing starts how long do you guys think it will take before we’ll see lights on? Meaning people living there.
900 and Epic there very nice.
Have any of you guys seen the inside of Marquis? The PH in this building really defines what a PH is other than just calling it a PH because its on the top floor. Also the four lines on floors 63-65 which are double volume also have a private spa for each and roof top terrace. Then the single PH at Marquis is on floors 65-67.
Also the kitchens and baths are very nice in Marquis.
After closing starts how long do you guys think it will take before we’ll see lights on? Meaning people living there.
I haven’t seen the Marquis yet, but it sounds like it is inline with 900. What about Icon? Are there any decent units there and is the finishing apartment or livable quality?
In regards to the 90% of other condos available in the greater Miami area, I still can’t figure out why somebody would spend hundreds of millions to create a beautiful high rise and let the finishing be so cheap. It is also very unfortunate that people actually buy this stuff, especially at such high prices.
AJ,
“Looks like any other cheap building in Brickell or buildings such as Latidude on the River. ”
Iagree kitchen and appliances are too cheap, like 1800 ghetto!
I was very bullish about 900 from get go (one of the first ones). But I am really surprised at the low closing rate. I wish that building all success.
But other than RT, no one seems to chip in on the comment I made about the stratospheric asking prices of MB units. No opinion at all?
I have been watching activity….I just don’t see the demand even with low interest rates. I have been amazed at how slow some of these units have been moving….watching several buildings and units and as they roll over 300 days on the market and reduced prices, still nothing. If anything, there are people waiting to sell…..not buy. Makes me concerned to buy at this time.
Lucas – AJ – RT
RT mentions closing rates and notice its been over four months since Lucas has posted a New Miami Condo Closing Rates post as a lot of us are curious about closing rates for the last of the new projects especially 900 Biscayne,Met One, Infinity, Axis, Everglades, Epic and Icon. AJ you have to admit that this MB units asking price coming in at $400. per sq feet is trending down. But the spread between the bid and ask will tell us more or as RT suggests there may be no offers as price discovery is non -existent. Lets watch this unit closely. Lucas wondering if this unit is owned by the bulk buyer at MB from a few months back?
Is it possible that these bulk buyers are starting to bleed a little bit?
Kramer – Just think for a minute what has happened to Trump Towers in SIB….finished tower 3 and it is a zombie. No closing, in limbo, nada, nothing. I heard it was going to be turned into rentals, perhaps timeshares, who knows……… but to hold a tower of 270+ units ON THE BEACH tells you something, or at least tells me something. Same with Solis….looks like something that stopped in Havana 50 years ago…rusting in place.
In this PH unit, how are they calculating the square footage of 2,703 sf? Are they using the open space of the second floor as another floor?
Just doesn’t seem like 2,703 square feet of hard floor space.
For example, there are 536 listings for $990K and up on realtor.com for ZIP Code 33160…..and that doesn’t include the vast majority of new construction condos…… Where are the buyers for these things???
southbeachsand:
good point. I looked that the attached floorplan, and doing basic math:
bottom floor:
40 (living+family) x 38.6 (stairs + living + bedroom) = 1544
top floor:
1544 – 572 (22×26) = 972
total under AC: 2516 (still need to remove half the stairs)
This is doing a lot of rough math in favor of the unit, not in my favor to get a lower number.
Then again, find me a home in Miami that lives up to the advertised square footage! I looked at buying a home that was listed at 4050 sq ft, and in reality it was 3100 after measuring and confirming with the plans. Even after pointing that out to the owner, he still upheld the 4050 square footage. Come to find out in South Florida (have yet to find another market like this) you can include a portion of your garage, patios, port-de-cochere, etc.. in your square footage as there is a roof over it.
I suspect this unit includes a portion of the open area on the second floor since you are technically paying for windows and a roof, although I don’t think there is anywhere in Florida/Miami/Miami-Dade code that allows for that.
Renter Tom:
Who can afford a 990K house? With banks being so restrictive on lending especially for loans that leverage the buyers income more than acceptable. Obama indicates that 2% of the wealthiest income earners in this country make >250K. Is it true that 2% of our homes in this country can be purchased by those same people? Looking on zillow.com for the top 2%, you would need to pay >1.7M. You do the math on how much you would need to afford a 1.7M house without leveraging yourself to be a major risk.
So yeah, I don’t know who is able to afford these properties. I was under the impression South Florida has dropped 40%+ in price with no real sign of slow down. Still with the large number of ~$1M+ homes/condos one would think it hasn’t fallen enough or the homes have not adjusted their list price in line with what is selling.
elvis – Don’t know who is gonna buy these things….there are sooo many of them and sellers have wishing prices while rentals remain half price of owning….. There is a short sale that I am looking at and will call on tomorrow I think…..I’m probably being stupid since why do I want to be stuck with a $1M property…..even if it is a “good deal”. Perhaps I should just a buy one small place in SoBe for the hell of it……
As RT has said, I think there are more people waiting to *sell* than waiting to buy. Some of these buildings have 50% to 75% (or more!) of the units listed for sale and/or rent, and then you go into the Miami-Dade property database and find that another 20% or more of the units are held by the developer and aren’t in the MLS.
I think there’s a massive game of “chicken” going on right now, with no one wanting to be the first owner to blink and take a big hit. Time will tell, I guess.
Tom, My biggest issue with buying a condo is the HOA and dues. Already the dues are high (as they include insurance), but getting stuck with a large assessment when only half the building is paying dues or insurance prices increase, is not something to look forward to.
For example, the unit I live in in Met1 was purchased for 970K in July 2008. The owner pays about $1100/mo in HOA dues and I assume about $1600/mo in property taxes. To me, that would be a lot of money to have to shell out every month after dropping ~$1M to purchase the place.
Oddly enough, if the market has dropped ~15-20% since then, wouldn’t the same unit be worth <$800K? I can tell you the two other same PH units are not listed for <$800K.
I looked at one line of units in one building (the best line) and only ONE had a homestead exemption and it too was for sale for 100k’s less than what they bought if for…..they will lose a minimum of $250K and could get worse. The rest were probably investor units as half had LLC names…..and the LLC will probably just cut their losses as some only “own” that piece of real estate…such as Building X 123, LLC.
Can ANYBODY Please tell me the TRUTH about whats going on???Are properties finally going UP?? Or are they still going DOWN???Theres a lot of Jibber Jabber going on here and I don’t know how to read it.I guess as long as RENTER TOM is still renting…………………it’s NOT TIME TO BUY YET!!!!!LOL Anybody have any thoughts on that one????
Joey,
Look at the case shiller reports, housing inventories, lending availability, number of foreclosures and general feel for can people afford these houses and are there enough people to afford the volume of homes (as pointed out by Renter Tom).
I don’t see much evidence pointing towards prices going up. Personally I think we are looking at 6-9 more months of a decline (assuming a 2.5-3.5% drop/month) in overall prices (using averages, not specific properties). I base this estimate on historical averages and general affordability.
Another indicator that I have heard from a very wealthy friend (who owns a lot of real estate in Miami) and has done so for many decades is when there are no more construction cranes, wait 6 months and then start buying. Jack Welch has also mentioned this same indicator. In downtown Miami, there are 6 construction cranes standing (I believe they are all commercial) and 5 of them are on projects that are well underway or almost done.