1800 Club Amenities & Common Areas
March 18, 2009 by Lucas Lechuga
Since there was a good response regarding my previous post about the deals to be had at 1800 Club, I've decided to include some pictures of the amenities and common areas before diving into a new post about the units themselves. I received a few emails from nonlocal buyers who are unfamiliar with the building so I thought a brief summary along with pictures of 1800 Club might help.
1800 Club has 469 total units across 42 floors. It was developed by BCOM, Inc. and completed in November 2007. The current monthly maintenance fee is 42.47 cents per square foot. Included in those fees are: basic cable TV, high-speed Internet, water, sewer, garbage and insurance on the exterior of the building. The amenities at 1800 Club include: 24-hour concierge and security, valet parking, swimming pool, hot tub, sauna, steam room, state-of-the-art fitness center and club room. 1800 Club is located across the street from Margaret Pace Park which has tennis courts, volleyball courts, a basketball court and children's playground.
Here are some pictures of the amenities and common areas at 1800 Club:
Interesting WSJ quote about the new Fannie Mae condo lending standards….purgatory sounds about right…
“These buildings are just in purgatory. This new requirement is the straw that’s going to break the back of a lot of projects,” said Norman Radow, an Atlanta real-estate investor who works with lenders to rescue distressed condo complexes. … It’s a weight being tied to a drowning industry.”
In terms of common areas, this is one of the less-attractive new buildings I’ve seen. The “1800 Club” logo combined with the 80’s checkerboard lobby isn’t working batman.
My prediction for this thread is 5+ posts from AJ showering praise on 1800 club.
That checkerboard pattern is hideous.
Lucas,
Great to see some of 1800 club. certainly a place i would consider living in over the long term. just not quite the neighborhood i am looking at, nothing wrong with the area just not my preferred zip code.
took a look see at some building list prices, and starting to see big and small cracks developing. solaris has really plummeted in list value-not sure if they are short sales or legitimate, but you are looking at nearly 50% haircut to a year ago. even plaza is starting to crack a little bit with 2B creeping under $300k-again not sure how valid the list price is there either. just an observation for now.
One comment: CHEAP
The long hallways made me think rental.
Kramer said “why would I buy there knowing that I cant re-sell to a prospective buyer who needs a mortgage. You need an exit strategy of some sort unless u plan on dying there”
So Kramer, tell me where are you going to buy? Where are you going to park your money? Each and every 50 odd new buildings are blacklisted by the banks and do not meet the Fannie Freddie guidelines. Even most of the old and established buildings in Miami and SOBE do not confirm to the new guidelines. SFH is your only option left for you.
I challenge anyone to show me one new building among the 50+ new buildings in the greater downtown that confirms to the new F & F guidelines.
……none? Yeah I thought so.
Even with US economy in the toilet, the World still wants to buy our T bills. It is because there is no other better alternative.
Same goes here. If you don’t want to buy in these buildings because aunt Fannie has a hissy fit, then don’t. Where else are you going to go?
All these guidelines are temporary or knee jerk reactions. They will all be eased out in the next two years. Even with the economy getting out of the hole in the next two years, these restrictions will also become meaningless.
So cash buyers chickening out and using Fannie as an excuse and comforting themselves for not taking that final step, don’t. You will only be doing a disservice to yourself.
None of these guys criticizing the decor do not have enough money to move into 1800 in the first place. Read #7. Where are the hall ways? Just goes to show the bullshit posters.
Anyway, I am not impressed with the quality of pictures. May be Lucas reduced the quality to reduce the KB size of the file for easy download. Pics don’t tell anything here. If you are serious about buying, go there and take a look.
The stars of 1800 Club are the views, the gym, pool, location and the Pace Park. If you want to excuse yourself because you don’t like a checker board decor we do not want you in our building in the first place. Prissy bitches like you cause all kinds of problems for our tightly controlled budget and our association. Both Jan and Feb numbers are out and we are spending less than we are earning leaving us in surplus. And we want to keep it that way.
Get lost to any building where you like the decor and pay up to 75 cents/sf or more in maintenance. We are very happy with our decor and the 42 cent maintenance.
AJ, when a decorator like your takes chances with an 80’s “Don’t Come Around Here No More” music video motif, he/she is asking to be judged. So we obliged. We judged. Verdict: It’s ugly. Deal.
OK, sorry I called you Prissy Bitches. But most of you are the first ones to scream murder if your maintenance goes up because of unnecessary upkeep needed for a lot of pretentious decor.
I will agree. 1800 lobby is not as spectacular compared to some of the new buildings made during the same period. I have seen all of them before zeroing on 1800. Ask Samir, he will tell you. I made him go with me to every building old and new in SOBE and Miami before deciding on 1800. If I am shallow like some people here and fell for the decor of a building or how many cute chicks I come across in the lobby, I would have been somewhere else and kicking myself now. Thank god I saw future and the future is the brightest for 1800.
As I said before, we spent less than we charged by maintenance in Jan and Feb. At this rate, next year either our maintenance will fall under 40 cents (unheard of) or we will have some rainy day fund for unforeseen circumstances.
We have a board and enthusiastic residents who thinks all the time how to control costs and run an efficient building. I could have posted a link with so much inside info regarding the same but it also has some proprietary information which I cannot share. But I thank god that I am in 1800 and not some other building. I saw this before hand by going beyond the razzle dazzle and I got rewarded for that. I am sharing that experience with those on this blog. If you want to benefit from it, go for it. If you want to ridicule it, suit yourself.
Time to call for a band of AJ. He is abusive and offensive.
Moreover, lending standards will get tougher for buildings where more defaults occur and short sales….such as the buildings already on the blacklists. Better to not play in this game AJ then have to choose among 50 losers at these prices.
RT,
It is called tough love. Sometimes brats like you need it.
And for the second part of your response, we all know that you belong to the NATO (No Action, Talk Only). So you will never buy anything ever neither in these “50 losers” nor even in “5 winners”. Why are you even on this blog?
Just live off the interest on your CD’s and enjoy your early bird specials.
LOL #14 AJ. No action? Too funny. I have bought and/or sold more real estate in one year then you have your entire life! I have been watching one line of units in one building compete for the low price….it has taken off in the last 45 days….interesting, but none have sold. I would buy one of their decorator ready units for $300/s.f. too only because of the private elevator lobby.
I’ll believe it when I get the invite for the house warming party.
“Even with US economy in the toilet, the World still wants to buy our T bills. It is because there is no other better alternative.
Same goes here. If you don’t want to buy in these buildings because aunt Fannie has a hissy fit, then don’t. Where else are you going to go?
So cash buyers chickening out and using Fannie as an excuse and comforting themselves for not taking that final step, don’t. You will only be doing a disservice to yourself.”
__
You are right AJ.
They lack the courage of their convictions, because they have no convictions.
The “I’ll wait until $300 psqf” becomes $200 becomes “I’ll wait until they are giving them away like in the 80s” becomes “It has a negative net worth, so they have to pay ME to buy that liability.”
Or could it be simpler as you ask, are they just chicken?
“None of these guys criticizing the decor do not have enough money to move into 1800 in the first place… Just goes to show the bullshit posters.
Prissy bitches like you cause all kinds of problems for our tightly controlled budget and our association.
Get lost ”
__
Couldn’t have said it better myself.
A condominium is a business relationship with all your neighbors. Those that cannot pay or don’t adhere to the rules will make your investment drop in value. Simply no way to educate or control 400 other people in your business relationship.
AJ
“we all know that you belong to the NATO (No Action, Talk Only). So you will never buy anything ever neither in these “50 losers” nor even in “5 winners”. Why are you even on this blog?
Just live off the interest on your CD’s and enjoy your early bird specials.”
___
Well that WAS uncalled for.
I think you really should apologize.
And I even agreed with you today, in an earlier post I wrote:
“Face it you are a bitter renter.
AJ is right, you’ll be kicking yourself for not buying when you had a great opportunity. Alas, life is short, and you are wasting it by waiting for this imaginary condo give-away. You ask about wasted opportunities.
Now I ask you, how many opportunities will past you by while you engage in this, and I quote, “hobby?” AJ has more than a point here.”
So, it’s not as if I do not see your point AJ, but attacking someone’s Early bird special is wrong, just plain wrong.
Lucas thank you for all the valuable info. you have been posting.I enjoy this blog very much. The best thing lately is that ACE has left the building.I hated the childish nonsense that was going on.Most of the Bloggers on here are knowledgable people and are amazing contributors.I like Renter Toms comments .He seems like a very informed contributor.Thank you again and keep the GOOD WORK up.
Will somebody please tell Muir the whole pro-AJ thing is not funny or amusing. It’s painful.
Why the heck is 1800 club so nasty?
I agree, muir, have you gone mad?
It’s not a horrible building but nothing special either.
No thanks,
No, it’s my way of protesting ACEs’ expulsion.
The best thing going for this forum.
(by the way all my links were real, and not from the Onion either. Though neither RT nor the Gables thought much of it, today was a game changer. And, as predicted, hardly a whisper outside of Financial publications. The FED is monetizing the debt (or Quantitative easement if you prefer sophistication,) and what is the lead in all newscasts except PBS? AIG.
Something even I knew months ago (no, not the details, I’m just a regular schmuck, it was just obvious and was predicted just about everywhere I went on-line.)
As I said yesterday elsewhere, the news is more like the Onion every day, except they couldn’t make this stuff up.
Lastly, RT cries about Obama this and that, on a day he should have been screaming at the top of his mind, he pretends wisdom by being nonchalant, but in reality just communicates his ignorance.
And you ask about madness, ha!)
but anyways, it was kind of you to ask.
Thank you.
I was at 1800 yesterday and I didn’t really like it. The 2br unit that has the direct bay view is really cookie cutter. I will admit though that the view was amazing. Also the decor is pretty bad and so are the hallways. I don’t get why AJ is always going apeshit over this building. How can you say that it’s stupid off someone to take the decor of a building into consideration when buying a unit? That’s not being shallow, that’s buying something you like.
I admire AJ,
despite all the evidence around him, he is resolute in his positive outlook. Some of you gloom and doom guys could learn a lot from AJ. It doesn’t matter what the na-sayers or statistics have to say about the economy or miami condo market, AJ’s faith in his investments are unshakeable. You got to give it to the guy, he believes his BS soo much it makes you want to believe for him. We need more of this kind of spirit in America today.
Keep on fighting the good fight AJ. Bagdad Bob has nothing on you.
here’s a hint, don’t be so quick to loose your temper and call people names, it makes you look desperate.
makes me think,
I too like and admire AJ.
And here’s 2 things that AJ has been talking about.
1. U.S. Economy: Housing Starts Unexpectedly Jumpedhttp://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=agLqzpq2jKIM&refer=home
2. March 18, SAN FRANCISCO (MarketWatch) — The U.S. dollar plunged against major rivals Wednesday afternoon —-> AJ’s = FOREIGN BUYERS!!
All I can say is that thank God we have someone of AJs integrity and wisdom and I too give my heartfelt “Keep on fighting the good fight AJ!”
Muir – I understand what the Fed is doing….large scale. Monetizing the debt in an indirect way….will evaluate. Obviously the goal is NOT to actually monetize the debt per se but to bring down long term rates esp w.r.t. mortgages. The first phase was “we’ll keep interest rates low as long as necessary which may be for a long while” which helped, but the fear of the second half of the hurricane made him do the not only are we keeping rates low but we’re going to keep long term rates low too….. It is a concern. Will evaluate. Miami Condos aren’t the answer though….
Juan,
OK, I trust that you saw the building. I will also respect that you did not like the decor. That is your personal choice. At least you are not one of the armchair commentators like the others who just spit crap with out knowing, learning or refusing to even know about a building.
Many are making amateur home buying mistakes. If you are guilty of signing a contract mesmerized by a buxom blonde sales girl, you are equally dumb to buy a condo looking at the lobby.
I did not buy 1800 pre con. You could have then accused me of “you did not know what you were buying and now you are stuck with it”. I bought it after I saw all the lobbies of all the buildings including 1800 and comparing. But I also saw what is behind the thin veneer of a glitzy lobby in many a building.
What exactly do you need a lobby for everyday living? 95% of the time you don’t even walk through it to get to your flat. You park in the garage and take an elevator up. Unless you want to impress your date, there is no need to even take them through the lobby.
I asked these basic questions about all the lobbies I saw. Is it comfortable, beautiful, functional, non wasteful and easy to maintain. 1800 I checked yes to all. Glitzy, it is not. The problem with glitzy and expansive lobbies is that it takes more janitorial and maintenance crews to keep it up in top shape. Every additional employee you have will cost you between a penny or 2 cents extra on your maintenance bill depending on the salary, insurance, health care and other benefits. Because we are such a tight ship, we could cut up to 6 employees since last year with absolutely no difference in the services provided. The resultant savings – almost no increase in maintenance.
Once you look past the lobby, ask yourself is this flat good for everyday living.
lets talk about a few things you look for in a good building and a good flat:
1. Layout, Balconies and Views. I gave top marks to the split floor plan, generous 6′ wide balconies and stupendous views.
2. Appliances. They are GE profile and de la casa kitchens. Higher end than average but not really flashy like the 900 biscayne appliances. But that is just fine for my purpose.
3. Pool. Unlike many useless pools in many buildings which are nothing more than decorations, this pool is extremely functional, delightful and always maintained at a balmy 87 degrees so that you can even swim in Jan when the air temp is 65.
4. Gym. Gym is the best I have seen in all buildings. Equipment wise, some gyms have more stuff than this one. But nothing matches its all glass windows overlooking Pace Park and its myriad activities and the incredible bay view.
5. Steam room, sauna and whirl pool. Nothing special but the building has all 3 of them and they are all functional and easily maintainable.
6. Common rooms and party room. I just want one and this has a nice enough party room attached to an out door veranda where you can have a party from 100 peeps indoor to 400 peeps including veranda. Simple and functional the way I like it. Some buildings have multiple common rooms. All lying unused but costing a ton in maintenance and electric bills.
7. Movie Theater. Does not have one. I never wanted a movie theater in a building. It is a gimmick and total waste and adds cents per sf to maintenance. My home theater system is as good if not better and I can watch a movie naked if I want to in my own flat.
8. Garage. Ahh, my favourite subject. You can have an early heart attack being in a boxed car. Have you heard the horror stories of the garages of Plaza at Brickell and One Miami?
The 1800 garage is the best laid out in any building that I know. Wide, easy to get in and out spaces. Wide roads or ramps to avoid collisions. Well ventilated and lit. Easy to get in and out with a total of 3 gates – 2 gates of two way traffic and 1 exclusive exit gate. This is unlike a single gate in many buildings causing multiple headaches. Never a line to get in and out. And also the garage exit is onto a non busy 18th street giving another big plus.
9. A very active intelligent and responsible board and owners who are proud of their building and work hard to keep it in top form at a very reasonable cost. You cant even pay for such services.
10. And the best part, the location and the Pace Park. I will not even go there as I have written volumes on these two subjects. Let us just leave it at that.
And those who are wondering why I am so passionate about my building, ask that question to yourself. Why are you not passionate about your building? May be you hate it and it is time to move. Give 1800 a try and You will fall in love not just with the building or the neighborhood but with life itself.
Wild Bill – I prefer the condo as a lifeboat analogy where everyone needs to row in the same direction but because of competing goals they don’t and in some with the new Fannie Mae lending restrictions they will revert to cannibalism.
AJ – If you love Pace Park then get off the darn computer and go jogging or something!
– On a macro level, credit is continuing to be pulled from the system on a massive scale….this will continue throughout 2009. Deflation will fight the fed at every turn as the fed and govt try to create at least a minimal inflation rate to no avail, meanwhile Florida unemployment rate will hit 12%.
I should clarify, the fed and govt will not be successful at creating core inflation of even 2% this year.
I looked at units in 1800 several months ago. I was pretty indifferent towards the lobby, didn’t love it or hate it. But I’m like AJ, and having a grand lobby isn’t that high on my priority list. I’ll be spending the vast majority of time in my actual unit, so the the highest items on my list are: 1) 2 bedroom, 2) direct unobstructed bay views, 3) spacious floorplan and nice finishes.
Taking my first two items into consideration, 1800 really offers only one 2/2 floorplan that faces directly east. After viewing several of those units, they defintately did not meet criteria #3. The units were very small (around 1200 sq. feet)…I didn’t even think there would be enough room for dining room table in the living/dining area, and the finishes were pretty cheap. Overall, not too impressive, IMO. No offense, AJ, just my thoughts on it.
I wouldn’t buy in 1800 Club for one simple reason – AJ owns there. Can you imagine living in the same building! Worse, being stuck on an elevator and having to hear about how glamorous 1800 Club is and that Pace Park is such a great park….argh!
DJ,
The 2/2’s on lines 3 and 9 are 100 sf smaller than the 1222 sf lines 5 and 7. lines 3 and 9 really have a problem as you mentioned regarding small LR and Bedrooms. But 1222 is just enough for my requirements. But I completely understand that you would prefer a 1400 or 1500 sf 2/2. Then you are looking at line 1 with 3 BR and it gets very expensive. A large sq. footage is a double edged sword. gables liked the 1715 unit but utterly dislikes the extra HOA required every month due to the extra 500 sf than the normal 2/2. He would have to pay 500 x 42.47 cents (about $250) extra every month compared to me.
But you like more space and don’t care about the additional HOA. Similarly I also recognize that there are people who just want a pompous lobby and common rooms and to hell with the associated cost. But I am not rich and I do care about the associated costs. In fact I was impressed by the common rooms and party rooms of Quantum before I bought in 1800. But I shudder at the thought of lighting, chilling these gigantic rooms with A/C, TVs, gadgets and maintenance costs in terms of personnel required for the 4 (Yes four!) party rooms, one theater, multi level gym and many mini lobbies in Quantum. I do not need all that. I need just enough and nothing excess which will put a big drain on my monthly carrying costs for the rest of my life.
So to each his own. If one can afford the 900 Biscayne or Icon Brickell style of HOA, I say go for it, who am I to argue about that.
RT,
1800 is too hip for you. Stay with the hip replacement crowd at the Sunny Isles.
RT, you better start spending that money.
WASHINGTON (Reuters) – U.S. inflation rose in February on higher gasoline and apparel prices, government data showed on Wednesday, indicating some pricing power in the recession-hit economy and easing fears of deflation for now.
But it was the Labor Department’s Consumer Price Index that attracted the most attention. Analysts said that while the CPI data showed the risk of a persistent, broad decline in prices was fading, it did not indicate a resurgence of inflation, given the deep slump the economy is in.
In February, the overall CPI rose 0.4 percent, the biggest monthly gain since last July, and above January’s gain of 0.3 percent.
“Kiss the idea of deflation goodbye. The brief foray into declining consumer prices over the winter seems to be over and done with,” said Howard Simons, strategist at Bianco Research in Chicago.
The Federal Reserve’s announcement that it would buy up to $300 billion worth of long-term U.S. Treasuries to keep interest rates low and help revive an economy now in its 15th month of recession ignited a brisk rally in U.S. stocks and the prices of government bonds. Major U.S. stock indexes ended the session with gains of about 1 percent to 2 percent.
This will be the first time since the period from 1961 to 1965 that the Fed has bought longer-term U.S. Treasury securities.
But the U.S. dollar sank to a two-year low versus the euro.
Analysts said the Fed’s latest move effectively left real interest rates negative across the board. The Fed kept the target for its benchmark overnight fed funds rate unchanged in a zero to 0.25 percent range.
APPAREL AND NEW VEHICLE PRICES JUMP
The February CPI data showed apparel prices up 1.3 percent, the biggest rise since a 1.5 percent gain in March 1990. Also contributing to the increase in the core inflation rate were new vehicle prices, up 0.8 percent, the largest advance since November 2004.
Compared with a year ago, core CPI rose 1.8 percent, creeping up from 1.7 percent in January, but still below the Fed’s comfort zone of 2 percent.
But some economists argue that the Fed’s liquidity injections are expanding the money supply base and may ignite inflation going forward if the central bank does not deploy adequate measures to withdraw that money from the system once the economy recovers.
“The shoveling of money into the system eventually can start to push prices higher,” said Bianco Research’s Simons.
“Once the economy recovers, we will have some real problems because at that point, the banking system will start to turn this monetary base into credit and will lead to an explosion of money supply.”
MORTGAGE RATES FALL
Earlier on Wednesday, the Mortgage Bankers Association reported that U.S. mortgage applications surged in the latest week, driven by a spike in demand for refinancing as the average rate on a 30-year fixed-rate home loan fell to 4.89 percent, matching a record low.
(Additional reporting by Doug Palmer in Washington and Lynn Adler in New York; Editing by Jan Paschal
After lots of research got to say I think miami is to expensive, those hoa are the deal braker. For that kind of cash I’d rather put more in the pot and buy a house in austin or califonia. With these places coming so cheap miami will struggle to attract foreign buyers like me.
AJ,
dont let the inflation/deflation press give you the wrong signals. we may have some core inflation (very slight) as raw material costs recover some of their price contraction from the past year, but prices overall are lower now than in the past and will not exceed those values in the near term. but of bigger concern, and not a part of the cpi and ppi indexes, are the declines in large asset classes-equities and RE. these are, without a doubt, down and will stay on the lower end for a while. the current rally in equities is more likely a suckers rally since we have had very little positive change in economic conditions. these large asset declines clearly offset any benefit against deflation being reported by the cpi. the most recent moves by the fed MAY help slow down the decline, but dont count on a direct recovery from these events.
finally i am hearing more on this blog indicate the waste of money associated with all the extra amenities in these buildings. i have made this argument in the past as well. these are sales gimmicks which cost the end user over time. developers who use over designed lobbies, theater rooms, party rooms, etc are not your friend and are going to cost you money. i live in a building with adequate, although not expansive amenities, and the HOA price is bad enough. cant imagine the cost with a more extensive arrangement.
as for floorplans, most of the newer construction fails in that 2B units are typically under 1200 sf. again another poor decision by the developer indicating lack of concern for the long term user. this floorplan is fine for a renter, but an owner really desires about 1400 sf-you need storage space in your own home.
gables
that’s why i say buy in a boutique building on the beach (e.g., montclair or harriet). these new buildings are absurd with the amenities and hoa.
Can’t Be Serious #42 – I think that Lucas is doing a great job even with the childlike behaviour of many of the contributers to this blog.
Credit to you for not crawling into the muck. Calling him a coward because he’s using a standard or referencing HOA on a sq ft basis seems extreme though. It’s quite simply a question of using your calculator to determine a monthly cost. I’d expect that any potential buyer of a unit would consider both the actual monthly cost as well as the sq ft cost. Only Lucas can answer, but maybe there was another reason why the post was erased. Lucas?
The one good thing Miami Condo’s have going for them is most people would like to have one.
Lets be serious here folks, having a luxurious high rise to escape too in a sub tropical and exciting city is what most people dream of.
The killer though is the taxes and maintence fee’s.
Most hardworking people who are responsible with money and invest wisely can come up with 200 or 300k for a vacation condo. I know someday (I am still young) I will come up with this kind of money for a second place.
The problem is I will never have the kind of money to plop down 200-300k and be able to afford an additional 24K a year in taxes and insurance.
Now snobs like AJ may say I am too poor to deserve a miami condo because I can’t afford the 24K in taxes and insurance alone on a second home but that is just being disingenuous.
There are so many Miami condo’s that got built that there are not enough “rich” people to fill them all. The only way to get these condo’s to end users is to reduce the association fee’s and taxes so hardworking, middle class people who are good with money can afford one also.
If you can’t get the affordability down to the level where a middle class person who is good with money can afford it (IE. lives on less then they make an invest the rest as opposed to media’s version of middle class which is debt strapped) then there is no hope for Miami condo market.
Can’t Be Serious,
I think you owe Lucas an apology, your post was not deleted.
Can’t Be Serious /Mar 17, 2009 at 3:16 pm Vote:
The $0.42/sf maintenance on that 1,700 sq. foot unit is $721.99/month!!!
I suppose that is why you refer to it in square feet (like it is some kind of friggin’ commercial property) instead of the total amount. At some level even you realize what a lousy investment it is.
Miami is the 4th worst city for new jobs this spring….that can’t help home prices if Forbes is right.
http://www.forbes.com/2009/03/09/cities-jobs-spring-leadership-careers-worst_slide_2.html?partner=yahoo
Lucas is posting the maintenance fees in cents/sq. foot because that’s how the individual buildings do it. Just go to the sales center of any new building and ask them what the maineance fees are, and their response will be “$.xx/sq. foot.” Obviously with the varying sizes of units in most buildings, they don’t charge a flat fee for all units, but do it based on square footage. Lucas isn’t being disingenuous by simply restating what an individual building charges.
Christopher,
You said:
“Now snobs like AJ may say I am too poor to deserve a Miami condo because I can’t afford the 24K in taxes and insurance alone on a second home but that is just being disingenuous.
There are so many Miami condo’s that got built that there are not enough “rich” people to fill them all. The only way to get these condo’s to end users is to reduce the association fee’s and taxes so hardworking, middle class people who are good with money can afford one also.”
How utterly, ridiculously wrong you are!?
Me, a snob? while I am fighting every penny increase per sf on the maintenance, rejecting pomp for functionality and proud to shout about it? Get real.
The prices of these flats is an issue market will take care of and I am all for lower prices.
But the methods employed by some on this blog to achieve this end is very troublesome.
If you and others channeled even a fraction of that energy to fight the taxes and out of control HOA, I will be your best friend! We will all have a common goal.
I have always said, whether it is an expensive car or flat, it is not the initial expense that is of concern. The loan can be paid off. My only concern is the recurring expenditure. For that we have to have a massive nest egg for the rest of our lives or keep working till we die. Unacceptable. If you buy in Mexico or Carib or Asian beach resorts, there is no killer taxes or HOA’s. Just the maintenance for the gardeners and sundry. No insurance rip off or nothing. If Americans continue to let the powers be screw them, they will continue to get screwed.
So if You, Mark, Mo, Ace and their aliases use their time and the power of their key strokes to make a difference regarding taxes and HOA, count me in.
On the MLS it’s not listed per sq. foot. It’s the total amount. Am I correct?
Christopher said
“If you can’t get the affordability down to the level where a middle class person who is good with money can afford it (IE. lives on less then they make an invest the rest as opposed to media’s version of middle class which is debt strapped) then there is no hope for Miami condo market.”
There is no hope until AJ capitulates. My guess in mid 2011 because AJ is stubbborn.