1800 Club – 2 Bedroom/2 Bath with Direct Bay Views – $385,000
March 25, 2009 by Lucas Lechuga
Below, you'll find a video of the view from the balcony of unit 3505 that I shot a few weekends ago. You'll also find various photos that I shot of the interior of the condo as well as the view.
Down the hall unit 350?, a 2/2 was purchased for $494,000 on 1/08. $442,000 loan from CountryWide. Showing taxes of $7,900. Not showing a homestead exemption. Loan requires owner to move in within 60 days as primary residence, unless they have an exemption Yet they have another address listed on tax records.
Tax records show unit 3505 as 934 sq. feet.
Majority of people who bought as of last year are looking at an easy $100,000 loss.
Wild Bill,
Why do you care what went for how much. This is a great unit and the price for an end user or second home user is irresistible. The question is do you have the money to buy this or will you just keep talking.
Some lucky person is going to get this for 385K. After this unit is gone, the only remaining units are all owner/investor units listed for $485K to $550K. And they will all hold. The way things are going, I won’t be surprised if the recovery begins in July instead of December of this year. And the minute people realize that things might turn around, they are not going to reduce any prices.
These direct East units are worth a million dollars for the people who live in them. May be not for those who want to buy to rent it out. But those who bought to live laugh at talk such as yours. So why don’t you be objective and don’t let the sour grapes attitude take you over.
I think you are the nelly who said that in 1800 Club only 1 foreclosure exists and that there is something wrong about that number. No there is nothing wrong with that number. Yes, it is only one. That shows that the 1800 is a solid building with good stable residents.
You also cast aspersions in the past about the low maintenance and spinning some kind of a conspiracy theory. Again, there is nothing cooked up. Everything is real and above board. The 1800 Club is a smart building (energy saving wise) and also run very diligently by smart people.
And finally stop talking about some imaginary safety issue after all your other scare mongering has been disproved. Just shows desperation. Why don’t you just stop hating those who live in 1800. They worked hard and living a good life. Don’t berate all their achievement in a fit of jealousy. If you can buy something for less than what the others paid, good for you. Come join the party.
The Interior of this condo seriously looks like my 900 sq foot condo in Michigan I paid $89,000 for in 2005 and is now worth $65,000 if I am lucky.
Not sure why anyone would find this to be a deal unless you think a view is worth 300,000.
That’s why don’t believe everything the tax records or MLS says. There is so much bullshit it is not funny. It is a 1222 sf under A/C and 252 sf of balcony.
Christopher,
No offense. I am not trying to be condescending either. Miami is not for you. If the weather, the views and a picture post card paradise like setting is not worth it for you, stay in Michigan. Why pay even $65,000 for a house, there are homes being given away for $100 to $500 in public auctions there. And it is not bad either. Some artsy fartsy people with little money in pocket and big dreams are moving there and revitalizing some devastated Detroit nabes. You should join them.
Please, I am not making fun of you or any such thing. It takes certain people to do certain things.
I will never ever pay to travel business class in a plane. If I get upgraded, fine. If not I won’t pay. I am envious of those sitting in the front but even if I can afford it, I will never pay 4 times to sit up front. Let us say they offered the seat for 3 times or even just twice the coach fare, still it is a no go for me. That is not in my DNA.
But I know that there are tons of people who would travel business and happily pay a premium for it. It is in their DNA!
So when it comes to a Miami condo, you are like me with the plane seat analogy. You love Miami like I love a business class seat. But you will never pay for it. You and your mindset is not built for that. Even if someone offers you a flat in Miami for free, you will still bitch and will not accept the offer as you said before ” The HOA on a Miami condo itself will pay for the Mortgage + Taxes + Maintenance of my Michigan house”
So why bother. It is not in your DNA. It takes a certain individual to appreciate Miami, St Tropez or Monte Carlo and willing to pay a premium to be able to own a piece of it.
Oh and don’t forget the USPS having 150,000 early “retirement”……..
OK, These photos absolutely do not do justice to the flat or the building. Sorry Lucas, not a stellar work.
I posted these pics last year I took of 1800, Pace Park, Views and a Direct East 2/2 flat. For the sake of those who are new to this blog, I will post them again. Also any potential buyers in this building, this is a must see slide show.
Enjoy!
http://picasaweb.google.com/biscaynebay/1800MoonriseOverTheAtlantic#
AJ,
In my opinion it is highly unbelievable for a building with over 450 units that only one unlucky resident was 30 days delinquent on maintenance fees. I know foreclosures are a different story and are not being recorded or processed timely enough banks. The tax appraiser uses adjusted square footage which I did not correctly mention.
“Please take notice of the following before contacting our office; the square footage on the tax records is an adjusted area calculation and will likely differ from “footprint” calculations.”
Using the same adjusted value for this unit and it’s neighbors it could be possible that the developer dropped this unit over $100,000.
I am not jealous of people possibly loosing $100,000 and more. Regardless of the views in 1800 Club units in Miami Beach are seeing 40% losses. This unit is a bargain is it goes to just under $300,000.
Condo developers need to rid themselves of extra units. They under cut previous sales to get rid of units. This immediately devalues the other units which are on the same line and have the same floor plan.
Christopher,
No offense. I am not trying to be condescending either. Miami is not for you. If the weather, the views and a picture post card paradise like setting is not worth it for you, stay in Michigan. Why pay even $65,000 for a house, there are homes being given away for $100 to $500 in public auctions there. And it is not bad either. Some artsy fartsy people with little money in pocket and big dreams are moving there and revitalizing some devastated Detroit nabes. You should join them.
___________________________________________________________
Aj, Why does everyone not from the area assume that the entire state of Michigan is Detroit? Lmfao.
No I would never live in Detroit even if the house was free. I live in the affluent suburbs of Detroit.
Example: THIS IS DETROIT:
http://www.erasmuspc.com/documenten/citypoems/022._detroit_city_poem_1b_by_estimmel.jpg
Example: THIS IS THE SUBURBS OF DETROIT:
http://pimage6.homesandland.com/image/2220/6/41/2220013416.jpg
I go to Detroit once or twice a year to see a game, 99.9% of the time I live in the warm saftey of the self sufficient suburbs which operate independently of the city.
I understand your plane analogy, but trying to compare where I live to the slums of Detroit is just false. There are no 1,000 dollar houses here, trust me. The 1,000 dollar houses are crack houses in the worst slums where you would not drive through much less live.
I believe this building was originally planned as an apartment development and this unit looks like the apartments next door at Bay Park Plaza. If view was my primary consideration I might consider this unit or one at Marina Blue. Both buildings offer small units with bad layouts and great views. What gives with the long bitter comments above?
I’ll admit the views are great. I looked at several units in 1800 and probably would have bought there had the units themselves been nicer. They’re far too small, IMO.
Also, in my humble opinion, this particular unit is still far overpriced. It’s $385k, but since it’s decorator ready, you’re going to have to spend another $30-$40k just to get it ready to move into. Sure you can save some money by putting in cheap laminate and whatnot, but do you really wanna do that if you’re spending this much on a condo? Even if you spent on the low end of my estimate, $30k, that brings the price of the unit up to $415k, which works out to $342/sq. foot.
I think being decorator ready, about $200/sq. foot is about what it’s worth in today’s market.
I was looking at this building too – but I’m not so sure its a good deal – but I definitely love the view.
I bought a Condo report on 1800 Club from condoreports.com and saw that there was another unit in the same line 2305 that sold in early 2008 (must have been a pre construction contract) for $362K – same exact unit type and view just a few floors down. Granted its on the 23rd floor, but we all know what the markets done since early 2008!
I also saw that the developer is holding on to 7 other units in that line – so you’ll probably see pricing drop further – they have around 150 units left that they still own (also saw that on my condoreport).
And as for the market being at the bottom, the FAR stats of 20K units in inventory with 403 closings in February… I’m no genius, but to me that sounds like about 4 years of supply and it doesn’t even count those units developers are holding on to…
Thoughts??
I don’t know AJ personally but just based on his comments above he comes across as a truly elitist prick. Someone needs a little attitude adjustment, or at least to spend some time in poorer parts of the world so that they can lose the chip on their shoulder…
AJ has got his biased head so far up his biased butt it’s a wonder he can see the keyboard! Someone needs a serious reality check — attitude adjustment aside . . . that goes without saying. Good luck finding a good surgeon to help with that other problem. Stop drinking all that kool-aid & pull out for some air.
AJ, nice pictures. Thanks for posting.
mr a j please tell me where the paradise setting is ?? i saw it in the keys, i saw it on the w coast of fla, and maybe key bis cayne and a few other select spots in the 305 but is biscayne a paradise ?
downtown miami is a paradise ??? it reminds me of nyc, but of angry puerto ricans, we have angry cubanos
love mi hente/ bet aj are you from the bronx /?/ palm trees and nice weather alone dont make a paradise
its like this girl that paid 400$ for a coach bag, i had a 25 $ bag for her that was nicer but it wasn’t coach
she used her coach bag for 6 months then got tired of it……..the point is that real estate is like any other item, if you want to come up with many reasons why you are over paying to convince your seld and others its cool because it is your $$
but from an investment stand point or a living in the unit standpoint it may not be the smartest move
i have been seeing many places for 120 k by the beach or aventura or other areas
should i pay 350 because its a ‘COOLER ” BUILDING ” AND TIE MORE $ UP IN IT ??
HAVE U READ THE BOOK THE MILLIONAIRE NEXT DOOR ???
AJ, we continue to have this debate and I am starting to feel that you are getting paid by the developer or something. Are you serious???
Like DJ said, if you buy and spend $30K in getting this unit ready for occupancy, you will be all in for $415k or $340/sf. If you think that is a good price, maybe you will consider buying another unit in the building since you seem to get aroused by this building.
With the developer still holding 150 units or so, how can you not believe that prices will continue to go down?
And BTW, this was probably your best comment yet:
“I won’t be surprised if the recovery begins in July instead of December of this year. And the minute people realize that things might turn around, they are not going to reduce any prices”
GET REAL AND MAYBE READ ABOUT THE CURRENT CRISIS
Off-topic, but this looks cool. First-time home buyers are already eligible for an $8,000 CREDIT, not just a deduction. Basically free money.
GOP Plan Aims to Expand Home Buyer Tax Credits
By Renae Merle
Washington Post Staff Writer
Wednesday, March 25, 2009; Page D03
House Republican leaders plan to unveil a housing package today that would increase the tax credits available for home buyers and would direct law enforcement to crack down on mortgage fraud.
Under the proposal, borrowers refinancing their mortgage would be eligible for $5,000 to help cover closing costs or to reduce their principal balance. The plan also revives a $15,000 home buyer tax credit proposal that Republicans pushed last year. This time, the proposal would require the borrower to have at least a 5 percent down payment. Both programs would expire in July 2010.
“We want to make sure responsible homeowners are able to purchase homes and stay in their homes,” said House Minority Whip Eric Cantor (R-Va.), who will introduce the legislation. “If you can get a $15,000 tax credit, that is a tremendous incentive to get qualified buyers back into the game.”
Brendan Daly, a spokesman for House Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.), said he had not seen the proposal but that Democrats are committed to strengthening the housing market. “We have already seen a boost in home sales due to the $8,000 tax credit for first-time home buyers in the economic recovery package signed into law last month by President Obama,” Daly said.
The Republican proposal also calls for providing additional resources to law enforcement agencies, including the FBI, to investigate and prosecute mortgage fraud. According to a recent study by the Mortgage Asset Research Institute, mortgage fraud jumped by 26 percent last year compared with 2007 even though fewer loans were issued nationally.
Republicans have not attached a price tag to their proposal and it is unclear whether they could gather enough support from Democrats to move the measure ahead.
The proposal also comes as lenders implement a two-part Obama administration plan to revive the housing market. It includes a program allowing borrowers with little home equity to refinance and a $75 billion program to give lenders incentives to lower payments for troubled homeowners.
HOUSING TURN AROUND /??? SUREEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!! U N E M P L O Y M E N T
MAYBE IN SOME PARTS OF THE COUNTRY I THOUGHT THIS BLOG WAS ABOUT THE CITY OF MIAMI ??
THE AVERAGE SALARY IN MIA IS ??? THERE ARE NO MAJOR CORPORATIOS THAT ARE PLANNING TO MOVE TO MIA
UNEMPLOYMENT CONTINUES TO RISE TOURISM IS DOWN
WHO IS BUYING ALL THESE CONDOS IN AT BEST AVERAGE AREAS LIKE BRICK AND DOWNTOWN ???
NY ERS ??? FUH GHET ABOUT IT ??? S AMERICANS >>> MAYBE SOME/
MIAMIANS THAT MAKE 80-140 THOUSAND A YEAR ??? ARE THERE ANY ???
FORECLOSURES ARE MUCH HIGHER, BANKS HAVE KEPT THEM OFF THE BOOKS,
PRICES WILL CONTINUE TO DROP, IF U DONT NEED THE BEST LINE IN A BUILDING OR EVEN THE “BEST BUILDING” WHICH IS ALL BS ANYWAY THEY ARE ALL BRICK AND GLASS
LOOK FOR ANOTHER 40-60 % LOWER PRICES IN 2010-2011 SO WHY WOULD U BUY NOW
WAS THAT THE SAME GUYS BUYING STOCKS ON THE WAY DOWN, ???? ITS NOT A V SHAPE RECOVERY
RELAX AND WAIT FOR THE BEST DEAL ITS A BUYERS MARKET AND WILL BE FOR THE NEXT 4 YEARS
Are the tax credits available for non-US buyers?
AJ, the pictures are superb. I think for the end buyer who is considering living in this area it is a good deal. In Miami prices probably countinue going down a bit but in Ft.Myers in good areas like Cape Coral foreclosure prices stopped going down and actually started going up a tiny bit. Investors and end buyers are buying houses in big numbers from all over the country and abroad. It is actually a bidding war. In Miami I see 2-3 deals/ day worth investing in great areas. They are mostly condo conversions on the beach and across from the beach but in Downtown area as well.
Financing is a huge problem that I see in today’s real estate market otherwise people would start buying in much bigger numbers.
Julian, below is an excerpt from this website: http://www.federalhousingtaxcredit.com/2009/home2.html
“I am not a U.S. citizen. Can I claim the tax credit?
Maybe. Anyone who is not a nonresident alien (as defined by the IRS), who has not owned a principal residence in the previous three years and who meets the income limits test may claim the tax credit for a qualified home purchase. The IRS provides a definition of “nonresident alien” in IRS Publication 519.”
What do you guys think of Artech and Aventura in general? Is the population young and hip?
DJ
Good luck on your purchase. Please keep us posted. It will be interesting to see how the banks are re-acting to short sales in a real time situation like yours. Can you give us a few more details without being exact about whether your offer was in one of the newer buildings or an established building and if so did you verify the delinquency ratio? Im guessing this is not an investment but as an end user. Thanks.
Artech
No it is not young and is not hip unless your talking about hip replacements.
Lucas why did you moderate my comment response to AJ?
Kramer,
Yeah I don’t wanna jinx myself by give up too many details, but the building is a new one. Hell, if you’ve read my posts here over the last few months you can probably figure out which one I’m talking about….same one I’ve loved since I first saw some units there about 6 months ago. I don’t know the exact delinquency ratio, but the association is still in the hands of the developer, and probably will be for some time.
Anyway, the current owner bought the place in 12/07 for $590k, and I put in an offer of $371k cash (asking price was $369k, but at that price, I was concerned there may be other offers). The unit is 1750 sq. feet, corner unit, best line in the building with direct unobstructed bay views. It’s also decked out with marble floors throughout, window treatments, lighting, etc. The listing agent is splitting his commission with a guy that has been negotiating short sales for 10 years, and they did their homework and are confident the bank will approve this price, based on comps, etc. I’ve got my fingers crossed, but I’m not gonna get too excited until I actually get an approval letter.
The best part is, last month I offered the developer $350k cash for similar unit, only decorator ready and three floors lower. Their asking price was $540k, and I stated with my offer than it was firm and I wasn’t going to be negotiating. They countered at $499k so I laughed and walked. I can tell you this, the developer is gonna be kicking himself for passing that up if this short sale goes through.
Christopher,
It went into “awaiting moderation” because there were too many links. I just approved it.
How long is a developer obligated to pay HOA on unsold units? For example, how long is Jorge Perez obligated to pay HOA on the unsold units (+/- 1,700 units) at Icon Brickell? If someone buys a unit at Icon Brickell, is there any assurance that elevators will continue running, pools will be cleaned, hallways lit, doormen/valets will be on duty, etc. for any particular length of time?
You mean the shower and tube aren’t separate??? YOU’VE GOT TO BE KIDDING ME! I can’t even remember the last time I used a tube shower combine….except on the rare hotel where they aren’t separate. But in a home for $400K, you have got to be kidding me…… Oh but they have stainless steel appliances…. LOL
Even worse….the one AJ posted, has a “jacuzzi” tub with the tub/shower combo! Wow, that thing will never be used as a jacuzzi….what a useless feature gimmick! Most of these cheapo jacuzzis are worthless.
AJ – what kind of floor is that with grout lines? My preference is to not use a white grout, but one that matches the tile color would have been a good choice in the future.
AJ babbled: “But those who bought to live laugh at talk such as yours. So why don’t you be objective and don’t let the sour grapes attitude take you over.”
Why don’t you just “live the good life” and STFU?
Your ramblings are like fingernails scratching a chalkboard.
Lara,
I heard about Cape Coral that it is actually doing very good.
Tom,
I use the Jacuzzi. It works really fantastic. Pour yourself a glass of wine, put on some nice music and relax in your tub with some bath salts. It will do you some wonders. Candle lights optional.
The next time I will hire you to do my interiors. In any case, before I move in myself, I will be redoing the entire place. I will do the seamless grout free flooring the way you like.
Person said: “I don’t know AJ personally but just based on his comments above he comes across as a truly elitist prick. Someone needs a little attitude adjustment, or at least to spend some time in poorer parts of the world so that they can lose the chip on their shoulder…”
AJ is a card-carrying Obamunist who hails from one of the world’s great sewers!
The problem with AJ is that he definitely did not grow up in the US and so his perceptions always clash with the majority of this board. This live for the moment we can change the world blah blah works for Sardinia and other European areas that have 2-hour lunches, and also worked for the Obama campaign; but in reality it doesn’t fly in the U S of A
To the average male millionaire that grew up in USA Suburbia and went to college then got paid, this quote from AJ below would be as enjoyable as plucking out an eyeball and AJ wouldn’t understand why…
“I use the Jacuzzi. It works really fantastic. Pour yourself a glass of wine, put on some nice music and relax in your tub with some bath salts. It will do you some wonders. Candle lights optional.”
The problem with those tiny jacuzzi tubs that are dual showers/tubs is that you have to make sure the tub is perfectly clean before using. I certainly wouldn’t want to use one in most hotels….even 5 star if the jacuzzi wasn’t separate. Do you really want to bath where people stand and shower? Moreover, the jacuzzi lines need to purged and cleaned on a monthly basis (at least) to prevent buildup of bacteria etc. They are a sales gimmick, have very weak and misplaced jets, and most people will admit they rarely if ever use one. Better to just soap in the jacuzzi by the pool or in a high quality spa.
I wouldn’t spend good money on a condo with a master bath that didn’t have a separte tub and shower. It is VERY costly to change later (unless you just make it a shower and forgo the tub) if it is even feasible in these condos. The condo I am in has a separate large two person jacuzzi with decent jets so I use it. You might even be able to squeeze in 3 people for the more adventurist…..but then again, AJ jacuzzi’s alone so the little one is OK for him! LOL Just kidding.
I think people are being a little hard on AJ…..he loves 1800 and he sticks by his guns, nothing wrong with that. I don’t necessarily agree with a lot of his opinions, but it’s always nice to have those contrary views.
AJ – How can you use the Jacuzzi if you have the place rented out???
DJ
You got me goin now. So with all due respect – what is the maintenance fee and why arent u worried about the delinquency rate? Im guessing over $1000. I mean $200 per sq ft and direct unobstructed water view is a steal and would assauge any concern over the maintencance fee, but id still want to know how many arent paying and an answer to Samsons question post #27 about how long the developer is obligated to pay maint. on unsold units. Because as the case with “Wind” where the bank foreclosed on over 200 units I believe Florida law caps their maint responsiblity at only 6 months or 1%. This is the issue holding me back from making an offer on some of the newer buildings downtown/brickell/pace. Im guessing “One Miami” since i havent followed your posts.
I have a jacuzzi in my townhouse. I used it once in almost 5 years now. That one time was to make sure it works. lol I am not getting rid of it because it will hurt resale value according to my realtor.
The view from this condo is awesome.
Kramer, it’s definately not one miami….I didn’t even look at that place because I heard so many bad things about it. The maintenance fee is $580/month. The building is 60% closed at this point. Like I said, it’s still in the developer’s hands, so that will likely go up at some point, but I don’t think it will be switching to HOA anytime soon unless there’s a bulk sale. Even then, it likely won’t go up by more than $100-150/month (just my guess). From what I’ve heard too, this particular developer is in far better shape than a lot of other ones down here, so I’m not too worried.
RT, come on…! You have 2 bathrooms. Use one just for Jacuzzi and another one to shower. You turned out to be a real elitist. Where is it coming from? Midwest?
lara,
re: Cape Coral
I wasn’t going to post.
But these incredible deals in Cape Coral.
Just how many have YOU bought?
I guess you’ll sucker some Europeans… maybe.
(You and I know that there are entire subdivisions from the 50s that have been reclaimed to swamp, hundreds of square miles, not far from there.)
How can you live with yourself prostituting your integrity this way?
At least AJ believes his insanity.
lara – For those prices….$400-$500 s.f. in this OVERBUILT market, unbelievable that you don’t get a separate shower! Come on, you’d have to be an utter fool to buy one of these things or were just dazzled by the status of owning one of these condos with all the glitz of granite countertops! A good master bathroom should be included, but a tub/shower combo is ancient! They don’t even build those in the MB of new homes these days do they??? Only trailer trash buys a tub/shower combo!!! I guess these are just vertical trailer parks!!!!! About the same size as one too, same quality (although trailers come with flooring!). I think there are several trailer parks that have a nice pool, etc. so I think the trailer park analogy is appropriate. I know, what can I do to convince someone to pay me a half million but don’t even give them a separate shower in the MB! hehehehehehehe Funny thing is, people went from bragging about owning one of these things (usually more) at cocktail parties to being a social laughing stock except that now we can hate those people too for contributing to the housing bubble.
Wow…..someone pissed in renter tom’s diamond crusted frosted flakes this morning.
Christopher
don’t forget to include maserati rick in your detroit synopsis. he completes the circle
AJ
i’m not sure why you love this building so much. regardless of lucas’s pics, the unit is just not that spectacular. in the end, you’re paying for a view. i guess if that’s what you really want, sure, make the purchase.
DJ – Not pissed, just being facetious…..maybe even a tad funny. But it is true, some of these sub 1,000 s.f. condos are about the size of a trailer except with the higher end appliances. You have to admit it is sad to have a combo tub-shower for those price points….. Not only that, it appears that AJ was going to put in SHOWER CURTAINS! Wow, talk about low rent.
THIRSTY?
“Broward County cuts off water to townhouse community
$8,100 owed to Broward; 60 percent of owners delinquent on fees”
— Oh, and the comments section of the article in #47 is pretty entertaining….all it is missing is an AJ to tell those that own the townhomes how lucky they are to own there and how envious everyone is of them even without water! I’m sure these things will get snapped up….by July!
DJ,
My guess is you made an offer for a unit at the Lexi since you had expressed interest in that building before. Just had two further questions. Is the best line in the building the one that is on the SE corner? And what’s the current tax on that particular unit? Good luck with your offer.